Abraham - Be Obedient - An Interview

Arnie Cole: You know Warren, every day we hear reports of wars and terrorist acts plus continued threats to our Christian values. But not only that, we have our own family and health issues to deal with. So how do we find this peace that passes all understanding?

Warren W. Wiersbe: Well we have to follow what Paul wrote in Philippians 4. By the way, if anybody cares to know Philippians is my favorite of the epistles. Written full of joy, 18 times you find joy and rejoicing in the letter. And yet Paul was in prison when he wrote it. I don't know if I could do that. But he tells us in Philippians 4:4, rejoice in the Lord always. Let your gentleness be known unto all men. And here's the part we need: Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God, and the peace of God which surpasses all understanding will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. In Philippians Paul gives us three very simple instructions. Number one, right praying. Pray about everything. People who don't have a disciplined prayer life are not going to have much of a godly life. Secondly, right thinking. He points out in Philippians that your mind is so important. And don't think things that are lies and don't ponder things that are worldly. So right praying, right thinking, and then right living. Obeying the Lord. And I tell you if we just simply follow those three simple roads, right praying, right thinking, right living, we'll have the peace of God in our hearts. You say how do I know? Because God tells us so and we can trust him. We need to remind ourselves that we don't live by explanations, we live by promises. And Philippians is loaded with promises, so that's my prescription right there.

Arnie Cole: So Warren, what is a disciplined prayer life? Help me understand.

Warren W. Wiersbe: Well a disciplined prayer life is like any other discipline. It's doing the right thing in the right way for the right purpose when you're supposed to do it. I thank God for a roommate I had at seminary. He'd been in the army and he'd been through some problems and God had given him great victory. But 5:30 every morning, and we're living in the same room, 5:30 every morning he was up reading his Bible and praying. I said well if he can do it I should do it. Of course our classes started at 8:00 and 7:00 was breakfast so you had to be there. But he helped me to develop a disciplined prayer life. Even today I'm usually up between 5:30 and 6:00 and I read three sections of the Bible. Don't always read a complete chapter but I read three different parts of the Bible. And then I have a prayer calendar and several calendars from ministries. Jesus said to his disciples, couldn't you just watch with me for one hour? And I learned the joy of praying and meditating on the word and just waiting on the Lord. And that's what developed my whole ministry. I find that many pastors are so busy they don't have time to pray. They don't have time to meditate on the word but they better take time because that's where the blessing comes from.

Arnie Cole: I was wondering too, be anxious for nothing, has that been a theme in your life?

Warren W. Wiersbe: Not always. Talk to my wife and she'll tell you when I've been pacing the floor or I've been a little upset about things. By nature I'm an introvert. People don't believe this but it's true. And introverts can be very active pacing the floor. Doesn't mean they're ignorant, doesn't mean they don't get anything done, but it's a part of nature. My wife is a patient one, she's very patient. So I think be anxious for nothing doesn't mean there will never be a negative thought in your mind. It doesn't mean that a situation can't disturb you a little bit. It simply means you're not possessed by it. The Spirit of God quiets your heart and God reminds you that he's in control.

Arnie Cole: Warren you were a pastor of three different churches and pastors I think have a tremendous burden for their congregation. Would people trip you up as far as anxiety goes?

Warren W. Wiersbe: I can't say I was anxious before I preached although I'm sure there was concern. Charles Spurgeon occasionally would have to slip off the platform before he preached and go throw up because he was under such pressure preaching the gospel to unsaved people. I've never gotten that far. I used to get to church early morning, evening, Wednesday, and when I was out in conference ministry I'd get to the conference early and walk around talk to people. Most of the time they didn't know who this was, they'd never seen me before. And I always watched for the children and the teenagers and had a little conversation with them. And this got me identified with my audience. And then when I stepped into the pulpit some of them would say I didn't know he was the preacher. But that's alright. It helped me to help people because I was with them. One of the churches I was in the chairman of the board told me we don't expect our pastor to make visits. Don't waste your time going visit people. And I said well you may not expect it but I think the Lord expects it and quite frankly I need it. So I started visiting people. And I went to Moody Church I started to visit people, especially the elderly people who had kept the thing going when it was in hard times. It did my heart good. I always went to the hospital either Friday or Saturday to visit our sick people. It gives you the right heart for Sunday.

Arnie Cole: Warren when we think of Abraham, we think of him being this amazing patriarch of faith. So it's surprising when you realize what Abraham was before God called him.

Warren W. Wiersbe: Well he was an idolater. He lived in Ur of the Chaldees and that was not some small bump in the road. Archeologists have carefully investigated Ur of the Chaldees. Books have been written about it. Population 360,000. That's a lot of people. And wealthy. They worshipped the moon goddess. And so when God called Abraham and appeared to him that was an act of faith on the part of Abraham to sell everything and move out. But he did it. Ur of the Chaldees was generally very, very advanced. They have uncovered tablets, clay tablets dealing with cube roots, mathematical things that you wouldn't expect. And of course the land around Ur of the Chaldees was a lush, lush land. So there was money, there was fame, there was power. Some of the houses they dug up had 14 rooms in them. So he came out of wealth to walk by faith with the Lord. That takes faith. But Abraham has been because of the record in the Bible one of the greatest examples of number one salvation—how was he saved? By faith. Number two, making progress in the Christian life. How did he do that? By faith. Hebrews 11 makes that very clear.

Arnie Cole: Warren in your book Be Obedient, you write that as you progress in the school of faith you will face three special tests. What are those tests?

Warren W. Wiersbe: Well test number one can be circumstances. I don't know how many times in the Bible, someday I'm going to count them, we find people saying Lord, how long? How long? When? When? I've done it myself. Lord, how long is this church member going to create problems? Lord, how long is this missionary going to suffer? etc. So we have the test of circumstances. And when you read about Abraham, he was a wanderer. Wherever he went he built an altar and he pitched a tent and he dug a well. Now that's a picture of the Christian life. I as a child of God as I'm going on my faith journey, I'm a pilgrim, I'm a wanderer. I live in a tent. One of these days this tent will be taken down. And I can be tested by that. It's a difficult thing with circumstances and people and things to see them as tools that God uses to make us what we ought to be. Abraham had to learn to wait—waited 25 years for his son to be born. Abraham had conflict with people—twice he went down to Egypt and lied about his wife and he had some neighbor problems. And then things—he no sooner got to the land that God gave him than they had a famine. Isn't that wonderful? I'm obeying God and now we've got a famine. And yet he was able to handle it except he made the big mistake of running off to Egypt. Now all of us are going to be tested by things. I need a new car or I need a better this or that or my body is not what it ought to be. I once heard a very famous preacher say churches are churches and people are people but God is God and that encouraged me. So he was obedient to God in spite of famines, circumstances, people—people down in Egypt especially—and things. By the way, I should say this lest somebody misunderstand me. Abraham made mistakes, so did Peter, so did David. The only person in the Bible who never made a mistake was Jesus. And yet the victorious Christian life is a series of new beginnings. You trip and fall, get up and start again. You said the wrong thing, apologize, get up and get started again. A series of new beginnings.

Arnie Cole: So Warren when it comes to faith, I remember myself as a new believer something bad happened and I wanted God to tell me why. Why did he let this happen? And it really started to trip me up. What about these circumstances where people just demand of God to tell them why?

Warren W. Wiersbe: Well I think most of us have been through that and one of the joys of victory over it is the peace that comes to your heart. The normal Christian life is a series of new beginnings. God does not owe me any explanation for anything. I saw an article in the newspaper one day, it says Don't debate with a three-year-old. I thought that's very wise. I wish I'd known that when we had some three-year-olds. But you see God doesn't owe me an explanation and if he did give me an explanation I probably couldn't really understand it. We live not on explanations but on promises. And so if God isn't working the way I think he should, I just get ahold of one of his promises. When God tells us in the Psalms or in the epistles who he is, what he does, he doesn't have to tell us how he does it or when he's going to do it. I still have things on my prayer list that I occasionally say Lord, do you hear me say this? I've been saying this for quite a long time. But eventually the answer comes. In one of the churches there was a particular situation that had been around for a long time. And I didn't touch it, I didn't attack it, I didn't preach about it, I didn't do anything like that. I just prayed. Five years it took to get that situation straightened out. Because more important than straightening out the situation was straightening out the preacher. I needed to learn to wait.

Arnie Cole: Twice Abraham was caught in a lie about Sarah being his sister rather than his wife. Why didn't he learn his lesson about lying after the first time?

Warren W. Wiersbe: Because Abraham is very much like you and me. He's human. I think that we have to remember that all of us are made of clay and we do repeat ourselves. I have a book in my library entitled Why Smart People Do Dumb Things. In the Bible you're going to find a lot of smart people doing very dumb things. But you know God forgives. One of the most wonderful things is the forgiveness of my Father.

Arnie Cole: In your study of Abraham you describe faith as a journey. And a good part of that journey is about waiting and being patient. Why is patience such an important lesson for us?

Warren W. Wiersbe: Well the Bible tells us that faith and patience go together. There are a number of references in the word of God. Hebrews tells us faith and patience enables us to receive the promises. If you don't learn patience you won't learn anything. Those of us who have raised children—children by nature are impatient. Let's go, let's go. Are we there yet? I can still hear our youngest when we were out on trips in the car going to see Grandma. You stop for a stoplight, Are we there yet? But Christians are that way. Lord, I want this to happen now. But you know I have looked back over my own life, I know you've done that too—God was never too early and he was never late. Never. We thought we had to do this right now—no, he didn't want it right now, he had it planned for later. So when it comes to praying and serving God, don't look at the calendar too much, don't look at the watch too much. Isaiah 40:31, they that wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength. They shall mount up with wings as eagles, they shall run and not be weary, they shall walk and not faint. That's a great verse to quote but oh is it hard to practice.

Arnie Cole: Many of us want God to move quickly and solve these things. So when it comes to patience, that is a tough thing.

Warren W. Wiersbe: One of my favorite writers has made this statement, quote, The purpose of prayer is not to get man's will done in heaven, but to get God's will done on earth. Now too often I have said Lord, I've got this all planned now here's the way it's going to go. No, no, just... and you know what he does? He just turns off the volume and I don't hear his voice. I say wait a minute I've done something I shouldn't do.

Arnie Cole: How do you distinguish between trials and temptation?

Warren W. Wiersbe: Well that's a good question and a lot of people get confused there. Easiest way to answer it is trials come from God, they are an act of his love, and he gets the glory. Temptation comes from the devil and temptation is accompanied by lies. The devil says to us Oh, you can get away with this, other people have got away with it, you can get away with it. So then we do what we shouldn't do and then he comes and says You're never going to get away with this and he accuses us. So I think the major difference is that God tests us because he loves us and wants us to grow. The devil tempts us because he hates us and he wants us to fail. Most children have a hard time with this matter of obedience and what obedience does to their character. They have to learn that we have to have trials if we're going to grow. A baby that never has exercise is never going to mature properly. So Hebrews 12 hits the nail on the head. You do it by faith, looking unto Jesus. Because Jesus was tempted and every temptation we go through he's been through so all we have to do is scream for help and keep on going.

Arnie Cole: How do we focus on God's promises and not get hung up on explanations?

Warren W. Wiersbe: That's a problem, it's hard. There are times when I've got to take what I call—I don't know if this is a good word or not—I call it a blessing break. You know people have coffee breaks and tea breaks and whatever else. I find I have to have blessing breaks. Sometimes I'm standing in the line at the grocery store waiting to be served and I just pause and try to have a blessing break, which means lay hold of some attribute of God, lay hold of some promise of God and just let it run through your system. And if we do that we're not likely to be afraid, we're not likely to want to run away. When we meditate on the word, Psalm 119:11, thy word have I hid in my heart that I might not sin against thee. When we lay hold of the word and the wonderful attributes of God it calms us down. When I find myself in a hurry and rushing about I know I'm heading for trouble. And so I've got to go and have a blessing break. Now that's hard to do in a busy life and then the Lord says to me Well you're too busy. It's about time you drop some things. I just thank God for every test he's put me through. One night I was driving home, a driver came around the curve on a highway going about 80 miles an hour and he was drunk and he slammed right into my car. When they got me to the hospital the chaplain of the hospital told my wife I wouldn't last out the night. A very encouraging guy. But I did last the night and I'm still here now because God in his marvelous, marvelous grace took me through the test. It was a hard test, a very hard test. Now we look back and say praise the Lord I wouldn't have missed it.